Probe Sex scandal to the last decimal: Justice B A Kirmani

Justice retired Bashir Ahmad Kirmani, who passed a landmark judgement in the infamous 2006 sex scandal involving the forced prostitution of Kashmiri girls by some pro-India politicians, bureaucrats, top brass of the police and paramilitary troops, says that the ground for conviction for those figuring in the list is already prepared to the last man involved in the crime. “Those who take salutes in parades, rub shoulders with the dignitaries and swear by the constitution during day time, “ he says, “can’t be expected or allowed to go otherwise during darkness of the night.” He spoke to the Conveyor correspondent, M Farooq Shah. Excerpts:

Many view the judicial system of Kashmir a nexus between politicians, bureaucrats and the judiciary.
In institutional sense, no, though individual instances cannot be ruled out. Personally, I’ve never experienced anything of this sort. One aspect of course is that ours is a closely-knit society and people happen to know each other so there’s is this ‘sifarish’ part-- a salient feature of our society. That sort of thing can happen but it invariably depends upon the judge who has to ensure that he’s not influenced.

It is believed that you were very keen to have the sex accused exposed before the public.
The whole story of the case is in the judgement. Somewhere in 2006, I noticed certain news items appearing in a section of the press, which were quite frightening. It had been very clearly reported that minor girls were being exploited by some people in power. Concerned about the gravity of the matter, I took cognizance and initiated so motto proceedings. Simultaneously, the High Court Bar Association filed a writ petition in the matter, which was treated a Public Interest Litigation and referred to a division bench. We asked the government to give us a status report as to what has been done and what was happening. The police also had conducted an inquiry into the matter and my impression is that had that inquiry reached its logical end, the case might not have attained that proportion which it later appeared to have.
But somehow that investigation did not conclude and we had to ask the CBI to step in. Government also passed an order. They referred the matter to the CBI and it took over. Then for around one year, we monitored the proceedings. In between a Special Leave Petition was preferred in the Supreme Court also but the order under challenge was kept intact, though they interpret it a little differently. Ultimately when CBI said they’ve concluded, we passed judgements in the matter. As per my judgement, those who were talked about against whom evidence came in the matter could be divided into three categories: First against whom there was enough material on record to direct taking of cognizance by a magistrate. Second against whom evidence or material on record was not enough to justify a direction for taking cognizance—but since there was material against them on record, they were named with a direction for further investigation against them. Third those whose names had been mentioned but material against them was not enough to name them in the judgement, so naming them would have not been apt. However, a fresh investigation was ordered against them. I mentioned the names of victims and victims who had to be re-examined for further investigation also.

The judgement copy of 8/10/2007 reads: The traders of flesh trade have to be brought to account, irrespective of their placement and position for which the Court cannot avoid indulgence. No body has been brought to book?
Perhaps the reason is the matter is pending before full bench of the court, unless they say something, it would not be possible for the agencies to follow up, though I personally feel that for settled parts of the judgement and un-assailed directions, there was no reason not to act, technically or otherwise.

At a recent meeting in University of Kashmir, you were quoted as saying: “For its own survival, the government hushed up the sex scandal.”
Perhaps the words used have not been reflected correctly, I said it involved people in and outside government, wanted the matter to be hushed up for their survival. It is my clear impression about the matter.

Why was the case handed over to the CBI? 
As I said, local police had conducted investigation up to a particular level but somehow that could not reach its logical conclusion. There was a general public cry in the entire valley, so the government in order to measure up to situation referred the matter to CBI and that they wanted a comprehensive investigation into the matter.

Within the first three months of its investigation, the CBI had arrested two sitting legislators who had been former ministers, a DIG of the BSF, an IAS officer, a former additional Advocate General of the state and two Dy. SPs of the JKP. It was right on course, wasn’t it?
During first part, the speed of investigation was definitely better than later. When magnitude of the case expanded, the speed slowed down.

Many Kashmiris believe that the CBI quickly lost interest in the case because of its implications on the larger politics as culprits represented the Indian State in Kashmir?
I can’t comment on that. My impression is that the CBI did take off perfectly well but as I said, when the area that the case covered started expanding, the investigation automatically got diluted. Still then, I was not, as per my judgement, fully satisfied with the pace and the quality of CBI investigation.

The final report of the CBI had 18 persons though a 3rd list of the accused containing names from outside the state also, was never processed and as such scores of bigwigs involved in the scandal may have been let off. 
I think that part of the story should be left with the full bench to deal with where the matter is pending.

The Court named the then Transport Minister Hakeem Yaseen, MLAs Ghulam Hassan Khan and Yogesh Sawnhey, DGP-rank officer Rajinder Tikoo, senior IPS officers Ashkoor Wani, Niyaz Mahmood and Shiekh Mahmood, former J&K Bank chairman Muhammad Yousuf Khan and owner of Hotel Broadway, Amit Amla. It is regarding these persons only that the CBI’s opinion of deficiency of evidence for letting them off had to be securitized. That never happened though?
That part of the case, I think, would be looked into by the full bench because this is one of the important aspects of the judgement I have delivered. I’ve also tried to suggest what shortcomings the investigations suffered in that behalf. The judgement is before the full bench and things may proceed from there on wards.

Why could you not arrive at a single judgement with your colleague, Justice Hakim Imtiyaz? It was sort of a split judgement, wasn’t it?
It was not a spilt judgement at all as there was no disagreement with the opinions expressed. Approach towards the use of case diaries and direction part differed. While I asked the CJM to take cognizance against the first category, directed further investigation into the second and reinvestigation into the third, the other honourable judge said that the entire material should be placed before the CJM to examine the material and then take an opinion on that.

How do you view the ruckus that the sex scandal created in the assembly after the former Deputy CM Muzaff Hussain Beigh’s levelled allegations against the chief minister Omar Abdullah and the patron of the National Conference Dr Farooq Abdullah?
Proceedings in the Legislative Assembly depend on how the worthy members view and react to various matters. It is not within my province to comment upon that. Legislative Assembly is their arena and there are rules by which they’re required to go. Whether they did or did not follow the rules, is for the speaker to decide. That part needs to be left to them.

The PDP has been demanding a fresh investigation into the sex scandal. How do view it’s role in dealing with the scandal when it was in power?
That was not my subject at all. I had nothing to do with who played what role. My knowledge about the case is based on the case diaries maintained by local police and the CBI. Local police diary has around 600 pages and that of CBI, 7000 pages comprising about 19 volumes. After going through all these case diaries, I arrived at certain conclusions. Who acted how, was relevant to me only in order to come to right conclusions in so far as the questions or circumstances under investigation were concerned. Performance of the government or any body from the government was not my concern at all. Demanding fresh investigation may be a view of the matter.

The Court observed that the occurrences reported are so horrifying that even a fraction only thereof would be a complete horror in itself. Under such circumstances, do you deem it proper that the case should be unearthed to the last man involved in the scandal? What would be its social implications?
I’d say an unqualified yes to that because the people, who ultimately surfaced as mentioned in my judgement, all happen to be high positions, enjoying all the amenities and conveniences of power. The matter has to be and must be probed to the last decimal. You see, you may tolerate a criminal committing a crime but you cannot tolerate a policeman committing a crime in uniform. You can tolerate an outlaw trying to subvert the system from outside but you cannot tolerate an insider subverting it from within by his commissions and omissions. Take the case of an officer of police or civil servant or a cabinet minister-- they’re keepers of the whole system and hold positions on which the whole edifice rests. In day time, they take salutes in parades, rub shoulders with the dignitaries and swear by the constitution, they can’t be expected or allowed to go otherwise during darkness of the night. If that happens, then society must stand up, take a strong note and act. On behalf of the society, the judiciary, the investigation authorities and the administration, must satisfy demands of the situation and if they do not, they will be failing themselves.
Moreover, if the society we’re living in is a healthy one, the implications would definitely be self-search and attempt to see what the reasons are, how did things come to that pass and attempt to initiate remedial measures. On the other hand, if it is diseased, then the entire social system suffers.

What legal significance does the case hold now? Should Kashmir forget about it altogether?
Legally the case is alive in all aspects. Forgetting it is anti-social. People can’t forget it, I’d rather say they should rather remember it, draw lessons and try to assess the rot that has stemmed into the social fibre and then take necessary measures to prevent it.

How far was it justified to hand over the Shopian rape and murder case to the CBI, knowing that their role was lackadaisical in handling the sex scandal?
At the stage and in circumstances it was done, it appeared to be right. The problem with Shopian is that it was mishandled at almost all levels by all concerned. Whenever a criminal offence takes place, it exclusively belongs to the realm of investigation and not to or political shadowboxing. In given scenario, the government was left with no option but to call in the CBI, especially when local police had reportedly denied to even registering an FIR. Something wrong with samples taken was also reported. I feel Shopian has become a difficult matter.

The interview was published in the December issue of the Conveyor magazine. Log on to www.conveyormagazine.com

'Taliban make only one per cent of Pak population’

London-based artist of Pakistani origin, Mushaal Hussain Mullick stunned one and all by her decision to marry former militant leader Yasin Malik who heads a faction of JKLF, an organisation campaigning for the independence of Kashmir from India. An artist of international repute and a prestigious London School of Economics student, Mushaal has temporarily moved to Kashmir after her marriage. She is currently putting up with her in-laws at Maisuma, a congested locality in the heart of the Srinagar city known only for anti-India protests and clashes. Mushaal says she has given up her lifestyle to adjust “with my brave and fearless husband.”  She says her art has been widely appreciated and accepted both in and outside Pakistan though she calls some areas in Pakistan as ‘black’ where Taliban have a presence. Not interested in politics, Mushaal plans to work for orphans through her art and wishes to put up permanently in Kashmir after finishing her studies, should she get a visa of a longer duration. She talked to Conveyor correspondent M Farooq Shah at her husband’s residence in Maisuma. Excerpts:

You’re being described as ‘girl with a golden brush’. Tell us something about the girl behind the brush?

I come from an intellectual family, my dad was a professor of Economics and my mom was in politics. I learnt a lot from my dad because he always encouraged us to debate on the issues of social and political importance and he wanted our suggestions even at the age of nine or ten. He’d ask us how you’d solve a problem if you’re given a chance and he’d explain the whole situation and then he’d leave it to us. He’d throw different magazines at us like Fortune, Economist and Time and ask us to review some articles on them and give summery on them. So it’s like I come from a background that’s like highly educated. When I was born, my dad took me to the library because he wanted that I should get the germs of a professor’s daughter and I should be absorbed in the library. My mom was very vocal and independent woman and she did a lot of social work. I got that instinct in me through my mom.

I was always fascinated by greenery, scenery and beautiful and stylish women, and I wanted to capture it in some way. I don’t know when I started to paint but I think I was just three or four when I started scribbling on the paper. It is my fascination for everything that is beautiful and that has inspired me to draw.

When did you pick up the first brush? What did you paint and when did it appear to you that you’re beginning to make a mark in this field of art? 

I think that was the age of five or six. I was crazy about painting. I’d lock myself in the art room when I was a small kindergarten class one student.  I’d just not get out of the room and my other classes used to start so my teachers used to push me out of the art room because I was so much into it and I’d start crying. I don’t know what exactly I painted for the first time, may be I just scribbled the first time over but I remember I drew a house and that was like when I was four and a half. I started drawing faces and portraits when I was six.  

You’re a B.Sc. Honours student from the prestigious London School of Economics and a painter as well. Who should you like to be identified with? 

Both. Art is a passion and so is Economics. Economics I think I got in my genes through my dad because he was an economist and I grew up listening about economics, budget sessions, recessions, booms and everything, so by the time I got into economics, I knew lot about it.

You’ve said that your inspiration stems from the ‘raw beauty of the feminine mystique’ and the ‘horrors of abject poverty’. How did it occur to you? 

It was during my O-level exams that I had decided my theme. We were given a free choice to decide if we wanted to concentrate on Leonardo, Rafael or any big artist like Picasso and study them and what kind of impact do they have on our life. I was like why just you need it to an artist when the biggest artist is God. I’m inspired by the creations of God.  I think the greatest artist is God. I just left it that way and that is when I started studying human nature through my paintings and I started making animals. I was more into figure drawing and portraits more than landscapes.

Your works such as a ‘rose that left a thorn behind’ and ‘forgotten love’ have widely been hailed in the West. What do such works explain? 

Such works simply explain the hidden beauty of a woman. Women should not be ashamed of being women that the way they’re suppressed in the world. There’s no harm in a woman being free. So it has to with their freedom also, their freedom of expression. This is may be a way of expressing freedom. My art is not like a dictation to anyone. You’re free to understand it in your way. You can perceive it in a different way and I can perceive my paintings in a different way. In my paintings all woman are beautiful, they’ve all kinds of fears in them and they should get rid of those fears and that’s the kind of opinion I had because they’re the most beautiful creation of God on this earth. Moreover, the works such as the ‘rose that left a thorn behind’ are a subtle reflection of my brother’s poetry. I’m greatly influenced by the Sufi saints like Rumi and artists like Picaso, besides the poetry of Oscar Wilde and the works of Khalil Jibran.

You’ve held several exhibitions all over the world including Pakistan. What has been the response towards your art especially in a conservative society as that of Pakistan? 

The response has been overwhelming, my teachers etc, they were always encouraging me to go ahead in this. I had my first exhibition when I was seven and I won an award then. When you go to see a painting, you go with an open mind. Art is an expression of freedom and if you dictate someone’s art, that’s not art.  I don’t do it for commercial purposes though I’ve sold a few of them.  The rest I’ve done for social work. 

Your works may not seem controversial in the West, but in Pakistan where militants have bombed girls' schools, murdered dancing girls, and destroyed music and video shops, they are simply explosive. Do you think about that while you paint? 

I’m completely liberated when I’m painting and that’s just one percent of the population of Pakistan. Talibanisation is something which has been in some areas of Swat, Balochistan or NWFP but in a very little percent. The people don’t support them. I come from a society which is not that narrow and there’re certain black areas of the society as well but they’ve never harmed me. I don’t like taking dictation from anyone and that’s not the kind of Islam I believe in. I believe in a liberal Islam. I’m not a Taliban or anything else. The Mughuls brought murals and figure drawing to the subcontinent. We brought art to the subcontinent. They were also Muslims, if they were not Talibans. You can’t just limit it to them that that’s what Pakistan is. There’re a lot of good artists there and we’ve a lot of freedom of expression there.

Your decision to marry the Kashmiri militant leader Yasin Malik stunned one and all. How did it happen?

Shaudhary Shujaat who was heading the PML (Q) had invited Kashmir leaders on lunch at Punjab House where I heard his speech. I was there with my mom. I couldn’t see his face at that time because it was crowded, so I could just hear him talk. When he was expressing his views on Kashmir, he said some poetry. That had an impact on me because our politicians there don’t use poetry when they’re talking to public or in a gathering and I felt that this man is emotional and I wanted to meet him after the function. My mom introduced me to him. Because she’s in politics, she invited him to a forum and asked him to discuss his point of view on Kashmir.  But he said that he was on an official tour and instead invited us to his signature campaign exhibition the following week.

The exhibition happened and my mom had a chit-chat with him about Kashmir there and before he was leaving for Kashmir he called up and proposed his intentions on telephone. We chatted on internet and got to know each other. Then my mom saw his mother during the Hajj that year. It took around three years for this whole to happen. Then he met my brother twice in America. So it had to become a family kind of thing because everyone had to be satisfied. 

You’re 23 and Mr Yasin Malik, 43 and on top of it he’s a former militant leader.

Yes I studied about his life and he explained to me that he has a mud house and lives a very simple life. We talked about it because I come from a different background. He said that I’m not going to lie to you and it is not going to be a bed of roses for you. He said it is always going to be full of challenges, I can be arrested and all. So I took my time and I studied. Then I was like his goal is so big that these materialistic things become small and minor. I was like one should go beyond this, so take the challenge.

Was it a difficult choice? 

Yes naturally, it was. I was hesitant in the beginning. It was difficult in the sense that when a man has such a huge challenge, then he has huge enemies as well. It is a controversial life. But there’s a high to it that you’re marrying a very brave man who’s not scared and who’s completely fearless.

While making a decision about Yasin Malik, did it ever occur to you that he would be jailed for ever? 

This is like one day before our engagement he got arrested and he said that he would be arrested for two years. I was aware of everything. I’d been reading about him and I just left it total to God because I respected him and I believed in him that he has a name and I prayed for him. I thought that I could be a good life partner to him. 

Government of India can lay hands on him any time, reopen the cases against him and he could even face a death sentence for his involvement in militancy related incidents? 

Then you pay a price for falling in love. You’ve prove that you’re in love.

Many believe that your marriage with Yasin is politically motivated and that Indian and Pakistani intelligence agencies are behind it. 

Totally rubbish. It was a completely personal affair between two families, getting to know each other and then finally deciding of tying the knot. It had no involvement of any political or intelligence agency whatsoever.

You’ve been in the valley for more than a month now. What has been your experience so far? Do you plan to stay put here permanently?

Overwhelming I should say. It’s like countless love, complete awe of the people and the beauty of this place. I’m awestruck.  I’ve been going to different places here. I’m a spiritual person as well and I want to go to such spiritual shrines because it gives me inner satisfaction. He’s (Yasin Malik) the same and we’ve lot in common. We’re like we’d go on a spiritual tour as well.  As for staying put here, I’m studying at the moment. When I’m done with my studies then I’ll decide on this. It’ll also depend on the visa probability. In case I get a longer visa, I’d very much like to stay here.

You belong to a sophisticated family in Pakistan. How have you adjusted in the small, noisy and congested house of Mr Malik? 

I don’t know, even I’m surprised. I’ve adjusted here even more than I’ve adjusted in my own home. I’m so comfortable here. I came with an open mind without any expectations that I’m going to adjust here and I’m going to prove it everyone. I like this guy and it’s my family’s honour and his family’s very loving. I’ve given up my lifestyle to adjust with him. Lot of people had this problem that I won’t be able to adjust here but I’ve. I’m comfortable with their food, their dressing. I wear Phirans all the time; I’m in love with them. I like the noise in the streets, the people crying all over, kissing my hand and feet. They’re literally happy because they’ve not seen happiness in years. That really moved me.

Notwithstanding the rousing welcome that you received here on your arrival, many argue that separatists in Kashmir have chosen to live a lavish lifestyle and your husband, in particular, has been in the eye of a storm since your marriage. The criticism isn’t all together uncalled for, is it? 

He’s living in a mud house and he doesn’t own a small car even. Can anyone explain what kind of a lavish lifestyle he’s leading? I know him; he’s like a gypsy, a jogi kind of person.

Pakistan's stand on Kashmir is that the Indian administered side too should ultimately accede to Pakistan. How do you view that stand?

I think Kashmiris should be involved in the peace process and then they should decide on the table what to do.

Do you plan to contribute to the Kashmir cause in any way say through your art etc?

I’m already contributing, doing my social work. I’ve contribute during the earthquake in Azad Kashmir. I’d like to work here, donate my paintings, and work for the orphans here. I’m, however, not inclined to politics and I’d not like to get involved in any such kind of thing.

The interview appeared in the November issue of the Conveyor magazine. www.conveyormagazine.com

Jeene Ki Tamana Say Marne Ke Iraade Tak

A personification of grace and talent, Waheeda Rehman, reigned supreme over Indian filmdom for three long decades. She was the quintessence of classic Muslim beauty with a truly transcendental appeal. Age has not dimmed her aura: the brilliance in her eyes and the attractive smile she wears across her lips have survived the ravages of time. Born on May 14, 1936, in Hyderabad, Waheeda Rehman made her debut in a Telugu film when she was just 13. During her stardom she used to frequent Kashmir on her filming assignments, and today she is here after a gap of 26 years. Kashmir has always been on her mind since her last visit, the versatile actress says in an exclusive conversation with Kashmir Observer chief correspondent M Farooq Shah.

FAROOQ SHAH: You've said that you've visited Kashmir around 26 years before. Do you feel any difference between 'the Kashmir then' and 'the Kashmir now'?

WAHEEDA REHMAN: Kashmir used to be the favorite shooting spot for all Indian filmmakers in 50's, 60's and 70's and we've always loved to be here. I'm a little disheartened to see the condition of the Dal Lake, whose waters used to be crystal clear. Encroachments all along Dal, too many people and lack of hygiene among the people have spoiled my mood. The silver lining, however, is that normalcy is returning to Kashmir, which could be a harbinger of a new era for the people of the valley.

FS:  How would you compare your times with the present, given the fact that a lot of indecency, vulgarity and obscenity have crept in to the Indian movies?

WR: Ours was the golden period of Indian cinema. There has been a strange change the world over with a sharp decline in morality. Indian cinema, too, has been overwhelmed by this change. I particularly get cheesed off on remixes wherein something else plays in the background and something else is being shown. I personally don't like that at all. Whatever's is happening in the film industry today can never be regarded as good film making.

FS: Have you ever been invited to hold some position on the censor board to have some real scissoring done on the tape?

WR: I've never held any position on the censor board.

FS: In your times, films were replete with good lyrics, good music and good themes. That seems to have vanished into thin air.

WR: In our times, love stories were being made abundantly which had good lyrics. The new trend, with the emphasis on violence, has marred the poetry as well. Moreover, Urdu speaking people have dwindled over a period of time, therefore the decay and decline in the lyrics.

FS: If you were to rank three of your films, which would you name as first, second and third?

WR: Guide is the crowning glory, followed by Mujhe Jeenay Do and Khamoshi.

FS: Have you said adieu to films?

WR: I wish I could. I get occasional offers to work, and having spent so much time in the industry, I can't muster the courage to say 'No' to them. I've recently worked in a film Om Jai Jagdish directed by Mr. Anupam Kher. Right now, I'm busy with another film with Girish Karnad.

FS: Apart from films, which you've said you do occasionally now, what're your other engagements that keep you busy?

WR: I'm working with a charity by the name Pratham. It looks after the underprivileged and less fortunate, especially to cater to their educational needs. Pratham means the first thing and education should be the first thing on one's mind.

FS: Tell us something about your family. Are your children too working in films?

WR: I've a son, Suhail who's done his MBA and works for a private company and a daughter Kashvi who is a jewelry designer.

FS: If you were to wish for one single thing , what would you ask for?

WR: I would definitely wish that peace returned to Kashmir as soon as it can. I'd like Kashmir to thrive the way it used to a long time ago.

FS: You've worked with a number of stars of the yesteryears, such as Guru Dutt, Raj Kapoor, Rehman, Mehmood and several others, who've left us for good. Do you miss them?

WR: It tears me apart to see people I have worked with leaving one after the other. You see, Mr. Sunil Dutt passed away recently. Sometimes a strange silence takes over whenever I think about them, and then it all appears to have been a dream. I think it's my turn now.

(The interview appeared in Kashmir Observer)

‘I want pride of Kashmir to be restored’

Prof Rahman Rahi is the only Kashmiri writer to be awarded Jnanpith, India’s highest literary award. He describes the honour as recognition to the identity of the people of Kashmir and their language, but says a cruel treatment is being meted out to the Kashmiris, blaming India, Pakistan and China for the confusion. Urging to fight against those who plot against the history of Kashmir, the 84-year-old Rahi says it is the language that should determine the course, for he believes if the language is taken away, the political independence would mean nothing. He says Kashmir wasn’t a state as one sees it today but a sovereign country which has been destroyed and enslaved since the invasion of Mughals. He spoke to M Farooq Shah at his Vichar Nag residence. Excerpts:

●You took a lofty plunge from a lowly clerical job in the Public Works Department into the field of literature and poetry. How did it come to you that you could make a mark in the field?

The plunge you’re referring to was not sudden. I had developed the passion for writing much before I took the clerical job in the PWD which I think lasted for 3 or 4 months only. However, I developed interest in the poetry during my childhood days while attending to various musical functions held at marriages and other auspicious occasions. Moreover, I used to borrow books from a bookseller in our neighborhood and gradually became a serious reader. This gave me the opportunity to lay my hands on as many books as I could and that broadened my horizon in more way than one.

●Why did you choose Kashmiri as medium of expression?

Amid the Urdu language dominating the cultural aspect of Kashmir, I initially began to write in my mother tongue only to realize that there were a few takers for it and I quickly switched over to the Urdu medium. It happened after I wrote a letter to Maulana Muhammad Syed Masaudi, patron of the Urdu newspaper, Khidmat which was the official mouthpiece of the congress party, about my interest in literature and poetry. He responded with an offer of the position of subeditor in the newspaper. I left the clerical job and grabbed his offer with both hands. Apart from the subbing job, I began to write on various issues with striking regularity. It was after the publication of the article, ‘Criticizing Marxism’, when a group of young men from the Progressive Writers Association, a party influenced by Communism, approached me. They said to me that you belonged to us and I joined the Association. However, I would find it awkward that my poetry was ignored while my colleagues like Dina Nath Nadim would get huge appreciation. This forced me to write in Kashmiri language.

●This was around the time when the political temperatures in the subcontinent were running exceedingly high. You’re a living witness to that bloodshed and massacre that followed the fall of British colonialism and India’s partition. Do your writings reflect that suffering?

Whatever happened after India’s independence, especially with reference to Kashmir, is conspicuously visible in my earlier writings which appeared in the form of the booklets, San’woun Saaz, Subhuk Sou’da, Kalaame Rahi and most importantly, Nau’roze Sabah.

●In case of Kashmir, many attribute the change as ‘out of the frying pan into the fire’. In the new political order, Kashmir lost its sovereign character pushing Kashmiris into a deep blind well without a vent.

Indians were fighting against the British rule but Kashmiris were striving for freedom from the autocratic rule imposed by the maharaja. Sardar Ja’afri, Faiz Ahmad Faiz and many other poets had questioned the freedom of India saying, Yeh Dag Dag Ujala, Yeh Shab Guzeda Sehar, Jiska Intizar Tha Hamei, Yeh Woh Sehar Tau Nahin (This blemished brightness, this dawn torn apart by the night, this is not the dawn we had been waiting for). Similarly, we felt that while some form of internal autonomy was given to Kashmir after the maharaja’s departure, it was not the freedom we had been yearning for. It is abundantly visible in the Kashmiri poetry. Dina Nath Nadim, Noor Muhammad Roshan, Abdul Ahad Azad, Mirza Arif, Mehjoor and several other poets have written about the changes that occurred during the various phases of Kashmir struggle and reflected the pain and suffering of the masses.

●Why did Kashmiris take to arms in 1989 against their reputation of being docile and nonviolent?

There’re several reasons to it and I think the persons actively engaged in it on daily basis are in a much better position to answer it. But I would say, whenever anyone used to write against the autocratic rule of the Dogras, he was well informed that Kashmir had a rich history of 5000 years at its back. Mehjoor wrote: “I was not the same before-- frail and enslaved-- but I wielded authority. Din Ga’weahi Mae’ne Kaene Yem Prae’ne Kaene Dae’waar Mea’ne (The remnants of the stone walls would speak for me.)”

By 1989, a common man had come to understand that he continued to be enslaved and was denied the freedom he was looking for. It occurred to him that he should put his word across a more vociferously.

●In a meeting at the State Cultural Academy, you read a poem: Yea’m Gayyea Ahensaye Avtaar, Te’a Aes Gayye Dah’shat Gard…Nishat Mou’rukh, Shal’maer Mou’rukh…Imam Mou’rukh, Hasaam Mou’rukh, Yea’me As’weane Shahrukh Subuho Shaam Mourukh… (They call themselves as nonviolent gods and call us terrorists… They killed the Nishat and the Shalimar; the Imam, the Hasaam; the morning and the evening of this smiling city…)

[Doesn’t answer the question and requests to switch off the device.]

●Tell us something about the book, Siyah Roude Jaren Manz (Under the dark downpour).

It begins with a poem on Kashmiri language apart from several others I have written over a period of time. I should say the freedom of Kashmir we’re talking about is meaningless unless it rested on the language of the masses here. Kashmiri is a compelling language and has a great potential. Unfortunately, the power that this language wields has not been discovered. Language holds the key if Kashmiris want to regain their lost glory and ascertain their existence.

●What does Jnanpith award mean to you?

This award is given away in recognition to the contribution made to the Indian literature. I was immensely delighted to see my name chosen for the award. It is not only the recognition to me as a poet but to the Kashmiri language also which was being looked down upon.

●You’re talking about pride of Kashmiris. The great Indian author, Arundhati Roy, denied the Sahatiya Academy Award in 2005 in protest against what she described as ‘undemocratic policies of the Indian government in controlling and administering Kashmir.’ Did it occur to you as well?

No, it did not. On the contrary, the ward gave recognition to me and my language and to my countrymen as well who speak this language. It gave them their national pride with which they can move forward and can tell everyone that they’re no ordinary folks. It was an admission by India that Kashmiris are a great nation with a rich literature.

●You’re known for the poem, Zinde Rouze Baapat Chhe Maraan Loukh, Tse Marakh na…Loute Paeth Cheakha Peyaale Ke’ho Uff Te Karakh Na…(People prefer to die to live …would you silently drink this potion and not say a word…)

I’m of the opinion that Kashmiris are not well acquainted with their patriotic sense and when I say that, I don’t count the days from Badshah alone. Once that sense awakens within them, their struggle would get a direction. We’re being meted out a cruel treatment and our identity is being denied. It is not only India, but Pakistan and China as well which have given rise to this confusion. The poem addresses that issue.

●Would you attribute the 1989 outburst to this poem?

Certainly, could very well be. Apart from many other things, people thought this poem aptly described their predicament because it carried their sentiment.

●You’re a strong advocate of the restitution of historical position to Kashmir.

Kashmir wasn’t a state as you see it today but a sovereign country which has been destroyed and enslaved since the invasion of Mughals. I’m not talking about the country of an ordinary Kashmiri but of the Kashmir of the great Mehjoor. Resultantly, movements of liberation from the slavery gained momentum from time to time. I’m of the opinion that the rich history of Kashmir spanning 5000 years be accepted and the pride of Kashmir be restored by whatever means.

●But that history is being distorted, misrepresented.

It is the duty of Kashmiris to fight against any such plot aimed at distorting his history. A common Kashmiri is continuing his fight on various levels, be it poetry, intellectual or practical. However, in his fight, he should bear in mind that his language is paramount to him. If the language is taken away from him, he will cease to exist even if he is politically independent.

●Over these years of conflict, people from outside came here and began to teach Kashmiris different versions of Kashmiriyat.

We’ve been taken for a ride while being called as people of the land of Reshis like Sheikh-ul-Alam and Lalladed. In the process, we’re asked to abandon the world and resign ourselves to God. The objective was to exploit this nation, de-link Kashmiris from their struggle of survival and push them into a den. In my essays, I have written that Kashmriyat has been abused and turned into a political slogan.

[The interview appeared in the July issue of Conveyor, www.conveyormagazine.com]